Normally I report on news, but occasionally, in rare instances, I become part of the news. That moment just occurred. Millions witnessed the incident involving my wife and I being surrounded by police after mistakes from law enforcement and Flock Safety’s systems led authorities to misconstrue that I had committed grand theft auto with a $155,000 Range Rover. The body camera footage of the event became viral.
The reason this narrative became a focal point, placing my face on numerous news broadcasts and my voice on a multitude of radio shows and podcasts, is no mystery: It fell amidst a fiery national conversation around Flock Safety’s expanding network of AI-driven surveillance cameras that police and federal agents can utilize to monitor individuals’ activities.
Just weeks prior to my encounter with law enforcement, we aired an episode of The Drivecast featuring security expert and Ent.AI CISO Matt Hurewitz discussing how license plate cameras monitor your life without a warrant. At the time, Hurewitz stated, “I believe if you wait long enough, there will be cases that impact people in a very real manner, sparking an important conversation.” Except we didn’t need to wait long—I certainly didn’t.
Flock automatic license plate readers (ALPRs) have consistently been in the headlines as police are caught utilizing them to stalk individuals. Moreover, Leonardo’s ALPRs leverage technology called SignalTrace to extract electronic Bluetooth device codes from your smart devices, creating a digital blueprint of your life without you ever needing to own a vehicle. It’s a frightening reality, and America appears to be speeding towards the prospect of becoming a surveillance state, if it isn’t one already.
In the latest episode of The Drivecast, we delve into the narrative of my grand theft auto saga, address inquiries people have been asking regarding why four squad cars and four cops were involved, and explore the surveillance state looming over America’s roadways along with what lies ahead.
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Complete Transcript
Kyle: Hi everyone, and welcome to The Drivecast. I’m Kyle Cheromcha, Editor-in-Chief of The Drive.
Joel: And I’m Joel Feder, The Drive’s Director of Content and Product.
Kyle: The Drivecast is our weekly show providing an inside perspective on the biggest stories, controversies, and individuals shaping the automotive sector. Sometimes we report the news, sometimes we become the news. That’s precisely what occurred two weeks ago when Joel released his report about being erroneously tracked by police through Flock license plate cameras and ambushed in a shopping mall parking lot, which, wow, I still can’t believe I’m even saying that. That story has circulated widely online, made global headlines, and it’s far from finished.
Joel: Yeah, I’ve had a rather hectic few weeks, honestly. I’m mentally and physically drained. But importantly, I wasn’t shot, did not go to jail, and, true to form, ended up working diligently on the largest and most significant story of my career spanning over 15 years.
Kyle: While I was frustrated and naturally concerned about Joel’s safety when he called me that fateful Sunday right after police released him, he was already brainstorming headlines and copy in real time. That guy is committed to his craft, among other things. Anyway, we’re extremely grateful that Joel and his wife are safe and that his kids weren’t in the vehicle when this occurred. However, it’s essential to note that the reason this story strikes so hard is because it was placed in the middle of a heated national conversation regarding Flock Safety’s expanding network of AI-powered surveillance cameras, which police can use to monitor much more than just license plates. Each week reveals more headlines about a new city establishing a partnership with Flock, another city terminating theirs after community backlash, or individuals running around dismantling every Flock camera they can locate.
Joel: Beyond data center expansions, the proliferation of Flock cameras signifies how AI and Big Tech are infiltrating every facet of our lives and communities without citizens having any say in the matter. At the same time, my experience notwithstanding, I must mention that police have often utilized Flock cameras to assist in solving actual crimes. You might recall back in June, just a couple of weeks before my incident, we had Ent.AI CISO Matt Hurewitz on the podcast along with Adam discussing Flock, Leonardo’s Signal Trace technology, and what all these new systems might mean for the future of privacy. What impeccable timing, right? Now, following one of the most chaotic weeks of my life, I’ve learned significantly more about how and why I ended up in Flock’s net and what could be done to prevent a similar fallout in the future.
Kyle: Today, we’re exploring Flock, the surveillance state overshadowing America’s roads, and the inside account of Joel’s Grand Theft Auto episode. By the way, if you enjoy what we’re doing, do us a favor and rate us with five stars on Spotify or Apple Podcasts. It genuinely helps to extend the reach of The Drivecast. Now, let’s proceed.
Kyle: Joel, it’s been a while since we’ve recorded a pod together. Clearly, what a subject to delve into. But hey, missed you.
Joel: It feels like an eternity. Honestly, it’s uplifting to see your face because whether I’ve been traveling, or you’ve been away, or I’ve been preoccupied with police matters, every interaction we’ve had in the past few weeks seems to unfold under either pressure, or scrambling to get a story out, or “this should make you perk up.” It’s rather nice to just be here and discuss for a bit. Even though it’s work, Kyle, it’s nice to chat and see your face.
Kyle: Even if it’s just discussing how you narrowly avoided arrest for Grand Theft Auto.
Joel: Minor details.
Kyle: Minor details, minor details. But still, it’s astonishing that this transpired. It occurred amid this period in which we’ve been exceptionally busy handling numerous other matters while running The Drive. This simply stands out as one story we’ve tackled in the past month, but it has evolved into the most significant story we’ve pursued all year. I also appreciate that you made that call to me immediately. I assume that means if you do end up getting arrested, I’m your first call from jail?
Joel: I guess we really should address: are you going to bail me out if I call you, or should I contact my dad? I think the first call ought to be to you, where you’ll answer and bail me out. How loyal are we to each other, Kyle?
Kyle: It hinges on the crimes and what the police would demand to free you from custody.
Joel: Fair point, fair point.
Kyle: Alright, so I’m aware that millions have encountered our story, have viewed the bodycam footage of you—handling it remarkably well, I might add. I’ve had many individuals tell me how impressed they were with your composure in this situation. But for those who haven’t or to summarize, what transpired?
Joel: So, ordinary Sunday, as one might do, my wife and I headed to Kohl’s. No Kohl’s Cash, I assure you. We were there to return an Amazon package, which is the most 2026 scenario, right? You visit Kohl’s to return an Amazon item, perhaps pick up some shampoo, who knows. Anyway, I was in a press vehicle that week. I was driving a $155,000 Batumi—I might be mispronouncing that—Gold, truly remarkable, Batumi Gold on a white interior, stunning Range Rover, exquisite vehicle, with $4,000 23-inch wheels, simply gorgeous. So, I back out of the space maybe two feet, and all of a sudden I’m surrounded by four police vehicles, four officers, sirens blaring, the entire spectacle. You’d think I was a terrorist. And I’m bewildered, thinking, “What’s happening?” I genuinely told my wife, “I wasn’t even speeding.” Even in that moment, you have to be Joel Feder and crack a joke, right? With cops approaching, I’m saying, “We weren’t speeding, dear.” So, we exit the vehicle, going through the standard procedures of, “Are you armed?” They pat me down, “Can I see your ID?” and then the real kicker, “Who owns this car?” Kyle, it’s quite complicated. You’ve been pulled over in a press vehicle before, you know it’s complicated.
Kyle: Yeah, they never grasp it.
Joel: So I literally stated—you can observe on the bodycam footage—with my hands raised, I added, “It’s complicated, can I explain?” The officer responds, “You can explain.” I’m not certain what else he was going to say, right? Like, “No, you cannot.”
Kyle: And you know, in that footage, when he states, “You can explain,” it almost sounded like, “You can explain, but I’m taking you in.” He was likely anticipating this explanation to be nonsense.
Joel: You can explain, but your cousin Vinnie’s plates are stolen, bro. I laid out the entire press vehicle situation, I work at The Drive, etc. And you can see the look of confusion wash over his face, and he inquired, “What’s The Drive?” I was taken aback. That was offensive! And he stated, “I’m not a car enthusiast.” I thought, “Yikes, I’m in trouble.” Luckily, one of the supporting officers chimed in, “I’ve heard of The Drive.” I was grateful, “Thank you, I appreciate you. You’re the hero here today.” Anyway, after we clarified who owned the car and I presented all the registrations, I asked him, “What’s going on? Why are we here?” Now he realizes I’m not a threat and the situation has diffused. I questioned, “Why are we here?” He indicates, “Well, this vehicle has stolen plates, and we need to ascertain if the vehicle itself is stolen.” I must have looked at him like he’d just landed from another planet because I thought, the vehicle is owned by Range Rover, the plates are owned by Range Rover. Can someone have taken plates and swapped them out in a parking lot or on a truck? Maybe, sure, anything can happen, but it seems unlikely. Yet the vehicle is owned by Range Rover. This is outrageous. The license plates on that vehicle were manufacturer plates from New Jersey, where Jaguar Land Rover is located, and they have a unique format: two large numbers (34 in my instance), two small numbers (10), and three large letters (DTM). 34 10 DTM—very significant. As he’s verifying the plates and determining whether the car or the plates are stolen—to clarify, neither the vehicle nor the plates were stolen—another officer and I were conversing, and I asked, “So how did we end up here? You got the stolen plates and whatever, but how did we arrive here?” He shared, “Well, we’ve been tracking you for days. Flock cameras picked you up two days ago. I was the responding officer,” he tells me—not the main officer—and continued, “I was searching for the vehicle, we couldn’t locate it”—because it was parked in my garage—”and then we got another hit today. We’ve been monitoring this for a couple of days. We received another hit today and found it in the parking lot. We were using the cameras in Kohl’s parking lot, we observed you, the entire scenario.” And I’m like, “Excuse me, did you mention Flock?” Because you know, we just recorded a whole podcast discussing that.
Kyle: I’ve heard of that.
Joel: We’ve done some reporting on that; you might have seen it if you read The Drive. And I thought, if I don’t get shot and don’t end up in jail, this is something noteworthy. I thought, wait until I involve Kyle in this. Even then, I was thinking of you, Kyle. I just missed you. So I inquired, “Two days ago?” He confirmed, “Two days ago I received the hit.” Whatever happened next, being Joel Feder, I asked, “Can I see the Flock hit?” He said, “Sure, no problem.” He pulled up his phone, accessed the Flock app, and sure enough, he produced two images. One image was sent—they both went to the police. One depicted the entire vehicle navigating a green light, I might add—fully visible. The second featured a close-up image of the license plate, which read—everyone listening, please say it along—34 10 DTM.
Kyle: Yeah, and the resolution was high enough that the 10 was distinct. It wasn’t like…
Joel: It’s a photo centered solely on the plate. The complete photo is the plate.
Kyle: Indeed.
Joel: And I was thinking—at this moment, I had limited knowledge, right? I’ve gained a lot more understanding in the last fortnight. I was thinking, “Interesting. Alright.” Again, I was clueless back then. Then we transitioned to the whole calling process; they informed me that the plate had been reported stolen from a Jaguar Land Rover dealership in LA per LAPD. All that data was incorrect, by the way, just FYI. We had to reach out to LAPD, they stated, and figure this out, and I’m baffled, thinking, “What on Earth is happening? Are we on another planet?” Turns out, the plates described as stolen—I’m using air quotes—were 34 03 DTM. What did everyone mention my plate was? It was 34 10 DTM. A completely different plate!
Kyle: But crucially, that little middle number, which is literally half the size of the other characters on the plate, is what was different.
Joel: To clarify, the entire interaction lasted about an hour, hour and a half, I can’t recall exactly. We confirmed the car and plates were not stolen, but they informed me that while it was 34 03, it had been registered in the system as 34 DTM.
Kyle: No middle number.
Joel: No middle number. Just 34 DTM. So importantly, they asked me, “Where are you headed today?” I replied, “Well, this is the first of numerous errands.” This is indeed vital; husbands always heed your wives, always heed your wives, since we had a bunch of errands to handle that day. I informed the officer, “Yeah, we need to go to Minneapolis, then Maple Grove, all these errands.” This was just our first stop. He casually said, “Oh. Had you headed to Minneapolis or elsewhere, they could have approached aggressively with guns. Various police departments adopt different protocols, right? Because this is a felony—the stolen vehicle and plates, that’s technically a felony. They assume I could be an armed car thief planning to flee. To be clear, I wasn’t.” So he cautioned, “Look, it’s clear in our system. Here’s the case number, and here’s my officer name, etc. But the systems don’t communicate. If you drive this vehicle to another city, Flock cameras will flag it again, they’ll alert the same thing, you’ll encounter this repeatedly, and not every police department will respond similarly. When is this vehicle scheduled for pick-up?” I said the following day. This was a Sunday; he said Monday. He asked me, “Where do you reside?” I told him. He commented, “That’s close,” I agreed. Then he advised, “Go park this car. Don’t drive this car around. Or if you must, without license plates, and if you get pulled over, just ensure no plates.” I replied, “Then I’ll be handling a different situation, and they’ll still see 34 DTM. That’s a terrible plan, by the way, Officer.” So I figured, alright, I’ll go park this vehicle. At that point, I had already consulted with the fleet and Range Rover. We’re summarizing an hour timeline here. In the weeks since, I’ve learned considerably. But the next day, before we even published our first article, I requested the police report. It was through this report I discovered it wasn’t a Jaguar Land Rover dealership. It was—and I’m uncertain if it was Jaguar Land Rover or a media company involved in the process—it really doesn’t matter. Someone had a media vehicle for a photoshoot in LA and lost a plate.
Kyle: Right, because typically during these shoots, they remove the actual license plates and put on a special plate associated with a brand or whatever.
Joel: They probably placed it roadside, perhaps accidentally left it on top of trash, and it fell off. It’s inconsequential; they lost a plate. It happens, truly. They reported it, and at the time, I was informed LAPD, LAPD and I had gone through numerous exchanges, and eventually, I learned it was the Los Angeles Sheriff’s Department, Lost Hills Malibu Station, which is a lovely area. When you report a plate as lost, it gets recorded as stolen. The rationale is, while it’s lost, if someone comes across it and uses it on a vehicle, it’s now classified as stolen. Sure, that’s understandable, but it was logged in the system as 34 DTM, not 34 03 DTM. This is human error, albeit significant. The system failed to catch it, allowing partial plates to enter. This resulted in entry into the National Crime Information Center database, administered by the FBI, which every police department then uses. Furthermore, crucially, this is what Flock, Axon, Leonardo—name any automatic license plate reader—utilizes as well, as these cameras lack their own database. They only extract data from the NCIC database maintained by law enforcement and the FBI. So if erroneous data goes in, what’s the outcome, Kyle?
Kyle: Poor data out.
Joel: Just like an Excel formula.
Kyle: Yeah, precisely. To the point the officer relayed to you, like, okay, Plymouth police, you had this interaction with them, they can document in their internal system that, okay, this plate is valid. But they can’t correct the NCIC database at the federal level. Thus, when he indicated, “If you visit another town, they’ll flag it,” that’s because it operates like a one-way street. They can’t inform… only the individual who filed or the officer who lodged the initial report can rectify it. Consequently, it’s essentially this mistake lingering around without resolution.
Joel: He explicitly stated, “Range Rover needs to reach out and rectify the error in the system.” However, I’m uncertain of the timeframe… even if you contact on a Sunday and someone assists you, I’m unsure how long that takes to be updated. There are numerous steps involved in that process. It’s chaotic. It’s a total mess. And that is before addressing every other element.
Kyle: So that essentially brings us to when we initially released the story. But before continuing, I just want to mention: your poor wife, who innocently joined you for a pleasant Sunday of errands, ends up caught up in this. I think we owe Karen something here.
Joel: A nice manicure.
Kyle: How did she manage this?
Joel: To be fair, at that moment we were separated. I couldn’t hear what transpired between her and the police.
Kyle: They separated you both when they pulled you out of the car.
Joel: Yes, they did. One of her major points was that while they asked me if I was armed, patted me down, all of that, they never inquired if she was armed or patted her down, etc. I’m uncertain if they know us well, but she’s the mastermind here, just so everyone is aware. First off, should a criminal venture ever emerge from this house, she will be behind it, just so you know. More importantly, I viewed the… that’s what she expressed to me afterward. I subsequently watched the bodycam footage, and it’s amusing because the police officer queried, “Who are you with today?” She responded, “My husband,” etc. Then he asked, “What vehicle are you in, who owns this?” Look, we switch vehicles weekly. This isn’t her responsibility, it’s mine. So I witnessed her in the bodycam footage lean over and check the vehicle to see what it indicated. She remarked, “Uh, it seems we’re in a Range Rover this week.” Can you imagine someone saying, “It appears we’re in a Range Rover this week?” He said, “Well, who owns that?” She replied, “I have no idea who the parent company…” This is such an auto journalist wife statement. “I don’t know the parent company of Jaguar Land Rover.” She couldn’t clarify whether it was Jaguar or Tata or anything. She stated, “I’m unsure who owns Range Rover; perhaps it’s Range Rover? The car is unquestionably owned by Range Rover or whoever owns Range Rover,” essentially. I’m just thinking, I adore you. That’s too funny.
Kyle: Incredible.
Joel: The officer was looking at her like, “What on Earth is happening?”
Kyle: Yeah, well, we would all like to understand what the heck’s happening there. So okay, you mentioned the bodycam footage. We requested it from the police under Minnesota law. As the individual in the footage, you have a right to that footage, so we were able to acquire it. We received the police report and published the initial story summarizing all of this. It went absolutely viral. I mean, we anticipated that it would, as we noted in the intro, it addressed numerous hot-button topics and represented a firsthand account of events that I believe no one had previously published. Following that, we had a very intriguing week. What did you learn? How did you contact Flock to release the follow-up story that we did, and what feedback did they provide? I think what people, including myself, want to know is: the plate recorded in the NCIC was 34 DTM. Your plate was 34 10 DTM. Did Flock’s AI system simply malfunction and disregard the 10? Was it intentional? Provide us with clarity on that.
Joel: Certainly. Initially, I was incredibly occupied with the local news and the attention that followed, with everyone wanting me to discuss the story. But amid all that, another automotive journalist contacted me, mentioning that a mutual friend worked at Flock. Just coincidentally, they had known each other for quite some time. Flock had seen the story—no surprise!—and was very concerned—definitely no surprise!—and they had a keen interest in reaching out to me. This individual was aware that this friend was a journalist, so they thought maybe we could connect that way rather than a cold call, and said, “Can you share his info?” So this person, being respectful and a buddy of mine, asked, “Can I provide them with your email?” I agreed… I wasn’t sure what they wanted at that point. I said, absolutely, share my email; let’s start with that. Someone in PR got in touch with me, stating, “We’re really sorry; we saw the story. An executive would love to chat with you about what occurred.” I’m like, sure. I had a myriad of questions for this person. At that moment, I was unaware of who the executive would be. They connected me with Josh Thomas, the Chief Communications Officer at Flock Safety. We engaged on the phone and had numerous discussions. He’s been incredibly pleasant, addressed all my queries, and never displayed defensiveness. Upon the call, his first words were, “I’m so sorry. Like, this outcome was unfortunate; thank goodness your kids weren’t in the car; I apologize.” That’s what you want to hear, right? You wish to hear someone take accountability and express, “I’m sorry; this should not have transpired.” Naturally, I dove into the questions. How did this unfold? It was evident I had a plate stating 34 10 DTM, which isn’t 34 DTM. I comprehend it was a data misprint; I understand that. However, my plate isn’t an exact match. How did this arise? Essentially, through several different scenarios and dialogues we had, A: bad data in, bad data out, right? Much like any LLM, you engage with Anthropic Claude, if you input erroneous data, you’ll get imprecise data back. More critically, he clarified that the police prefer this structure, and the rationale they’ve set it up this way today is because there are often incomplete details to base assessments on, right? Partial plates or whatnot, as an eyewitness merely observes the first few letters or whatever. Ultimately, law enforcement desires this system established to prompt alerts when matches arise, correct? So the framework was instructing Flock to “Search for 34 DTM.” Hence, that’s precisely what it did. It discovered 34 DTM. I possessed a 34 DTM plate; it just coincidentally had a 10 attached. Nowhere in the definitions or system instructions is “AND check for anything more” instructed. It just said: find 34 DTM, found 34 DTM, did its intended task. It produced what it was directed to find, then delivered it to the authorities. Mr. Thomas elucidated that this should be a human interaction loop, akin to your other AI LLM systems, right? Humans input into AI or LLM to issue commands, the AI executes it, and provides a result, which necessitates verification and evaluation, etc.? So it produced the photo, generated the alert, dispatched it to the police, and he stated, “They received the image; they ought to have evaluated the image. A 10 is visible, correct? They can enter 34 10 DTM into the system.” They didn’t. He’s absolutely right; they did not. He’s also correct that Flock was instructed to scavenge for 34 DTM, which it did and detected it, hence transmitting it out. That said, I inquired: it recognized the 10; I saw it in the photo, right? He replied, “Yes,” considering he examined the image, right? They reviewed this beforehand. I queried, “Why can’t it simply be programmed to indicate that, there’s an ‘AND’ there, there’s a 10, a flag there?” He responded that’s not the manner the police wish for it to function at the moment with the machine learning; that’s not what they’ve mandated. It’s evident it could be set in that fashion, right? Prior to conversing with him, per Mr. Josh Thomas, Flock has already reached out to the LA—well, he claimed LAPD, but I assume he meant the LA Sheriff’s Department—regarding who logged this, how it incorrectly went into the system. They mentioned they’ve liaised with the FBI and the NCIC database to comprehend when incorrect entries occur, how to recognize errors, and crucially what they can present to officers for reference of like, this isn’t an exact match, it’s not a direct match, this is akin to a match based on what you wanted us to investigate, which would essentially be a hybrid, correct? So it could still dispatch the report of “34 DTM, I located it,” whilst additionally offering a qualification remark suggesting, “By the way, there’s also a 10 here,” indicating a flag, kind of proposal, right? Thus he mentioned they communicated with the FBI about the NCIC database to explore ways of providing context to officers about what the results depict, to supply additional details if it’s a partial or something like that. Moreover, he genuinely expressed interest in discussing with me, wishing to grasp my experience,” because a typical user doesn’t hear about this.
Kyle: I comprehend what he’s articulating. The systems function as they’ve established based on police requests, and this is what they assumed to be most beneficial, essentially presuming appropriate, secure data in terms of a complete or valid license plate input. It’s essential to note that this has occurred previously; Flock has maintained operations for a few years now, and there have been instances where it misreads the plate or erroneously registers a digit or number, subsequently leading to improper stops such as this one. However, what he explains is that this instance had no anomaly; ignoring the 10 was intentional, as that’s how the system is programmed. To me, that seems inexplicable, especially considering they didn’t have a framework to denote “this is close enough” or “this is an actual match.” It seems rather simple to include that distinction in programming, and the absence of it is somewhat disconcerting.
Joel: Indeed, as I mentioned, he explicitly said—and I’ll quote him now because I have the article pulled up—”The way that law enforcement prefers these tools to operate is that if any of the characters they’ve inputted into these hotlists are detected, they want to be alerted.” He further added, “Now what we strive”—this is him speaking about Flock, right?—”We aim to guide officers to do what you mentioned: confirm that 34 DTM aligns with what I’m observing as 34 10 DTM.” By the way, we’re getting ahead of ourselves. I also spoke with Plymouth Chief of Police Eric Fadden about this since, to Mr. Thomas’s claim, the police indeed received a photo, it displayed the 10, they actually observed the legitimate vehicle before I even reached it while I was in Kohl’s, which had a valid plate on it. Consequently, I naturally put forth a series of questions to Chief Fadden. I’m jumping ahead, but I concur with you, Kyle. Whether it simply didn’t detect it, whether the police dictate it operate this way, then to Mr. Thomas’s argument, collaborating with the FBI and NCIC to generate context regarding the results—yielding what you requested, but by the way this extra info exists, like highlighting or circling the 10, I don’t really care how it gets done, but officers should have received some kind of alert if you’re going to offer a partial read alongside that plate, indicating there’s something else present to ensure visibility. I’m optimistic that Flock will capitalize on that feedback.
Kyle: That was my conclusion too. Despite the scope of the narrative and the passionate debates ignited nationwide, I doubt a single story will eradicate the dissemination of Flock or prompt significant pushback from law enforcement. They value this tool. This tool has proven its efficacy; they will consistently engage with it. The pivotal action needed—and it appears conversations are underway—is for Flock and these agencies to pinpoint how to collaborate more effectively. Legislative reforms must occur on the governmental front; numerous systems require updates, as you rightly pointed out, and Flock must ensure awareness of how their apparatus is employed and assume greater initiative in training personnel or establishing these safeguards to avert situations from recurring. This is relatively recent; as we’ve indicated, Flock has emerged and proliferated only over the past few years, thus we are in the initial phases of this development, and adapting must occur rapidly parallel to these cameras proliferating.
Joel: We necessitate legislation and regulations, whether regarding functional use, the nature of data generated, who possesses access, or how long such data can be stored—all these elements. We require consistent legislation and regulation.
Kyle: Here’s hoping, here’s hoping. That’s it for this week’s episode of The Drivecast. Sincere thanks to Flock, the LA Sheriff’s Department, and the Plymouth Police for providing us with the simplest scoop ever, Joel for remaining composed in a tense circumstance, our editor Tyler Mark, and thank you for tuning in. We’ll return next Wednesday.
Joel: Don’t forget to check thedrive.com for our comprehensive coverage on this subject and much more. Subscribe to one of our excellent newsletters, which are complimentary, by the way. Follow us on Instagram, Facebook, and TikTok, and subscribe to our YouTube channel where we have a wealth of exciting content forthcoming with Kyle.
Kyle: That’s right. See you next week. Bye, everyone!